Mecum Las Vegas

Status
Not open for further replies.

BigEd

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
It means some of the numbers in the engine are the same as some of the numbers in the frame. It's often used in the same description as "Perfect condition for restoration," or "It ran before it was put away."
It sounds like house sales talk. e.g. Bijou, rooms are nice as long as you don't want to turn around in them.;)
Heaven forbid the day when hospitals say he was OK before he died on the operating table.o_O
 

Somer

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Total match = UFM/RFM/ engine all match.
Semi match = UFM OR RFM match engine
Non match= Frame/engine from different bikes.
 

Simon Dinsdale

VOC Machine Registrar
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
From a Machine Register point of view:

Matching numbers = factory stamped engine, crankcase mating number, UFM & RFM that left the factory as one bike.

Non matching = Anything else (with genuine factory stampings)

Restamp = Anything with fake / altered numbers.

Simon
 

Somer

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
2 out of three ain't bad ! I've found more bikes with the RFM changed due to stripping of adjusters or breakage/splitting.
I guess I don't see them as a total mis-match. We all bring different perceptions.
 

TouringGodet

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Administrator
VOC Forum Moderator
Indeed, if you have 2 out of three, it is best to have engine and UFM being the 2.

Now, my Comet, purchased as a basket case, is quite a mismatch. All three major items are different, and even the outer covers on the engine have a different mating number than the crankcases. At least the outer and inner primary match, and those two match the timing cover. And the two crankcase halves match each other. If they didn’t, now that would be a TOTAL mismatch, ha ha.

But I don’t care. I had a chance to obtain the correct UFM and RFM, but I would have had to buy the complete Comet being offered. At that time, I felt the asking price was a bit high, even considering a small premium to the benefit of reuniting the pieces. Just wasn’t worth the hassle to me, partly since the bike was overseas.
 

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Matching numbers = factory stamped engine, crankcase mating number, UFM & RFM that left the factory as one bike.
Non matching = Anything else (with genuine factory stampings)
Anyone who doesn't want to pay a lot more than they should to buy a Vincent should take heed of the above since they are the only two categories knowledgeable people use to determine what to spend on machines for their own use. Numbers don't determine how well a machine works, but they absolutely do determine how much you, or your heirs, will be able to sell if for later.

We all bring different perceptions.
My observation is that perceptions of many things, including what constitutes "matching numbers," depends on whether or not someone is in the business of selling motorcycles. There's a good reason it's caveat emptor, not caveat venditor.
 

Gene Nehring

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
I am curious to know what happens if a MOT department re-stamps because of a crash? If the crashed bike down the line is rebuilt who has the correct numbers? According to the club I guess the original would? According to the law maybe the rest amp would?
 

vibrac

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
What also needs to be said is buying a non matching bike will cost you less and when you come to sell it you wont loose any money as the relationship on values is retained. and for sure from the saddle you cant read numbers
 

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
What also needs to be said is buying a non matching bike will cost you less and when you come to sell it you wont loose any money as the relationship on values is retained.
Neither of those statements is necessarily correct. As for the first statement, if a buyer accepts that a "semi-matching" numbers bike should sell for nearly as much as one with matching numbers, they will pay too much. However, whether or not the second statement is true depends on accurately predicting the future, a practice that is fraught with uncertainty. Despite that, here goes...

One factor is that, when new, top of the line models sold for not much more than lesser models (e.g. a Bonneville vs. a TR6 Trophy), but today there is a larger price differential. Another factor is that thirty years ago there wasn't as much concern about matching numbers so many Vincents with and without sold for the same, but since then the price differential has only continued to grow. So, I'll speculate that in the not too distant future, when a large fraction of vehicles are electric, more restrictions are in place on older gasoline vehicles, and fewer people are interested in old motorcycles, the price differential between 'matching' and 'non-matching' will increase so you will lose money because the present relationship won't be retained.

Again, if you only care about riding, and don't care how much you will or your heirs will be able to sell it for, a non-matching numbers Vincent would be cheaper.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top